Is Obama in danger of driving votes to Nader and McKinney?
Given that it seems increasingly likely that Barack Obama will be the nominee of the Democratic Party, now might be an appropriate time to raise some doubts about his viability as a candidate in the fall. A popular claim for some years on sites such as DailyKos, MyDD, and sometimes TPM, is that votes for Ralph Nader were responsible for putting (and keeping) George W. Bush in the White House. Is the Obama candidacy primed to repeat this situation?
Marcy Winograd is an Executive Board member of the California Democratic Party. She initiated a story that has played on MyDD, Huffington Post, etc., that Obama operatives have been involved in a purge of possible delegates from California to the Democratic Convention to be held this summer. Winograd suggested that the California Obama campaign had purged almost all progressive anti-war activists from its delegate candidate lists.
I am reminded of the situation at the Democratic Convention in Boston four years ago when Kerry was nominated. Anti-war demonstrators were shunted to obscure locations in pens surrounded by police and security so that they would not be seen or heard. People carrying an anti-war message inside the convention floor, including delegates, on signs or on clothing or pins, were confronted by convention security and forced to remove the messages. Of course, Kerry campaigned on what was essentially a pro-war position, which would have marginalized the anti-war people anyway. I guess the thought on the part of the Kerry people was that with Bush as the Republican candidate, the anti-war vote would go to Kerry even though Kerry, too, was a pro-war candidate. Even so, it seemed at the time to be foolish to thoroughly antagonize anti-war Democrats by marginalizing them physically as well as in terms of policy.
Now, the appearance is raised of similar Obama attitudes, with anti-war activists being purged from the roles of possible delegates. Granted, some more recent reports have held that the purge is being undone, but the damage has been done to the extent that a basic tendency similar to Kerry’s of four years ago exists in the Obama campaign. Whether this indicates that Barack is less anti-war than his posture has suggested is unknown to me, but it certainly raises that fear. This fear is compounded by reports that Obama’s Iraq advisor, Colin Kahl, is saying that Obama will keep 60,000 to 80,000 troops in Iraq for years to come.
Quite independently from the question of how one should read the tea leaves in all of this in terms of what they portend for the policies of an Obama Presidency, there is the short-term question of what this means in terms of votes leaking from Obama to the very real candidacy of Nader, and the possible Green Party candidacy of Cynthia McKinney. When Democrats complain about “Naderites” costing Gore and Kerry the past two elections, my thoughts go to the ways in which their candidacies encourages such votes. I know several people who tried to vote for Kerry last time (because Bush/Cheney are so completely terrible), but ultimately couldn’t get themselves to vote for “the other pro-war candidate, Kerry.” Don’t count out the possibility in a 2008 Obama race that many won’t be similarly tempted if Obama equivocates his positions. I, for one, already am alarmed at his argument that the war in Iraq is distracting the US from “the real war in Afghanistan.” So far as I can tell, Osama Bin Laden is long gone from Afghanistan and the poor folk who are dying there at US, British, and other NATO hands aren’t responsible to much of anything that merits what is being done to them.
There are other signs that Obama is willing to give up many votes to Nader and/or McKinney. His consistent pro-Israel tilt, of course, seems calculated on the perception that his candidacy cannot afford a vigorous anti-Obama attack from the pro-Israel lobby. For me, however, some of the good of his famous “more perfect union” speech was undone when he referred to Israel as a stalwart ally and placed the blame for the problems of the middle East as “emanating from the perverse and hateful ideologies of radical Islam.” There are plenty of legitimate reasons for people the middle East to resent both Israel and the US that don’t follow simply from some perverse Islamic ideology. The seeming dismissal of all responsibility for Israel and the US (and other Western powers) by Obama is appalling and it too will bleed votes from the Democratic nominee to Nader/McKinney.
Obama repeatedly has stated a willingness to meet with foreign leaders who have been banished from diplomatic contact for years, including the leaders of Cuba, Iran, and North Korea, but he has resisted the possibility of meeting with the Hamas leadership of Palestine. "They're not heads of state. They don't recognize Israel," Obama said. "You can't negotiate with somebody who doesn't recognize the right of a country to exist." Yet, Hamas was elected by the Palestinian people in an election that outside observers, including the pro-American politician, Jimmy Carter, as legitimate.
So, even as Obama campaigns as the candidate for change, he is inviting many to view him as the same old same old. He’s for talking, so long as the pro-Israel lobby won’t be prompted into attack mode against him. Apparently the anti-North Korean and anti-Castro lobbies are perceived as less powerful, so he’s enthusiastic about change that they won’t like. He’s anti-war in that he talked against the war when Hillary voted for it, but he has consistently voted to continue funding it since he entered the Senate. Now, by all appearances, he has no enthusiasm to permit a visible and audible anti-war presence at the Democratic Convention. If the election in November is as close as the current polls suggest that it will be (and as close as the last two Presidential elections were), should we be surprised if Obama’s losing margin is less than the votes that go to Nader and McKinney? And if this happens, will the Democrats again be blaming the “Naderites” or will they blaming the failure of the Democrats to provide a clear alternative to the pro-war policies of the other pro-war party?
I may yet find myself able to vote for Obama in November (although I cannot imagine being able to vote for Hillary, even against McCain; she hasn’t distinguished herself from the Republicans sufficiently for my vote). Obama’s recent behavior, however, is lessening that possibility.





Short answer? No.
April 12, 2008 6:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
What is it that makes you think that Obama will not be driving votes to Nader or McKinney? Were my reasons for thinking that he will wrong? If so, how?
April 12, 2008 6:58 PM | Reply | Permalink
Oh, at least read his whole quote in context before judging him. And if you want your faith renewed, read "The Audacity of Hope", at least the Values chapter.
April 12, 2008 6:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
OBAMA: So, it depends on where you are, but I think it's fair to say that the places where we are going to have to do the most work are the places where people feel most cynical about government. The people are mis-appre...I think they're misunderstanding why the demographics in our, in this contest have broken out as they are. Because everybody just ascribes it to 'white working-class don't wanna work -- don't wanna vote for the black guy.' That's...there were intimations of that in an article in the Sunday New York Times today - kind of implies that it's sort of a race thing.
Here's how it is: in a lot of these communities in big industrial states like Ohio and Pennsylvania, people have been beaten down so long, and they feel so betrayed by government, and when they hear a pitch that is premised on not being cynical about government, then a part of them just doesn't buy it. And when it's delivered by -- it's true that when it's delivered by a 46-year-old black man named Barack Obama (laugher), then that adds another layer of skepticism (laughter).
But -- so the questions you're most likely to get about me, 'Well, what is this guy going to do for me? What's the concrete thing?' What they wanna hear is -- so, we'll give you talking points about what we're proposing -- close tax loopholes, roll back, you know, the tax cuts for the top 1 percent. Obama's gonna give tax breaks to middle-class folks and we're gonna provide health care for every American. So we'll go down a series of talking points.
But the truth is, is that, our challenge is to get people persuaded that we can make progress when there's not evidence of that in their daily lives. You go into some of these small towns in Pennsylvania, and like a lot of small towns in the Midwest, the jobs have been gone now for 25 years and nothing's replaced them. And they fell through the Clinton administration, and the Bush administration, and each successive administration has said that somehow these communities are gonna regenerate and they have not. So it's not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations.
Um, now these are in some communities, you know. I think what you'll find is, is that people of every background -- there are gonna be a mix of people, you can go in the toughest neighborhoods, you know working-class lunch-pail folks, you'll find Obama enthusiasts. And you can go into places where you think I'd be very strong and people will just be skeptical. The important thing is that you show up and you're doing what you're doing.
April 12, 2008 6:56 PM | Reply | Permalink
None of the things you have to say have to do with the questions I asked. Nader took quite a few votes from the Democrats in the past two elections. Many Democrats have complained that those votes cost the Democratic candidates the elections. In many ways Obama seems to be inviting the same set of voters to vote for someone other than him. He's giving lots of reasons for such voters to view him as not a real progressive anti-war candidate. What is he doing to keep such votes in his column?
April 12, 2008 7:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
I was answering your statement that his recent "actions" have made you waver in your previous conviction of voting for him.
Why is that? Do you only vote for people that are guaranteed to win?
Maybe this is why we will lose in Nov. Maybe that's why Obama is uniquely positioned to win, because he can continue to remind people of what really matters, no matter what is flung at him.
April 12, 2008 7:07 PM | Reply | Permalink
I rarely have voted for anyone who has won, unfortunately. I did vote for Bill Clinton once, although I cannot look back at that with any pride. I've given many donations to Democratic candidates who lost and to the Democratic Party, who typically lost with my support. Your comment misses my points.
April 12, 2008 7:15 PM | Reply | Permalink
Does what he stands for also include keeping anti-war activists out of the Democratic Convention, as Kerry did? Does he stand for blaming Islamic perverts for all the problems in the middle East? Jeremiah Wright knows better than that. Why doesn't Obama. The answer is that I suspect that Obama does know better than that, but he hasn't the fortitude to say so. There's much to be admired in his campaign (and thanks for blocking Hillary from the nomination). But I've described some reasons that he will drive many voters from him to Nader and McKinney, and I think we need to face up to them.
April 12, 2008 7:18 PM | Reply | Permalink
You're obviously not very informed about his nuanced understanding about Middle East issues.
April 12, 2008 7:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
Obama's "nuanced stance" on the middle East absolves Israel and the US from responsibility and places responsibility on the perverse ideologies of Islam. He calls the elected representatives of the Palestinian people terrorists and refuses to speak to them. I understand what Obama said. I understand the politics of it also, and I understand that it will drive away many voters to Nader and McKinney. Nuanced, my back side.
April 12, 2008 8:22 PM | Reply | Permalink
Maybe it's that SOMEBODY is trying to become president. A vote for Nader or McKinney IS a vote for McCain, a vote for war. Get that in your head now.
It's not just that the Repugs are good at getting their vote out. It's that liberals like you are too "principled" to make a compromise and thus end up losing the whole deal.
If you DON'T want to go to war with IRAN, I'd seriously suggest you start convincing your liberal friends to vote DEM.
The repugs have an easy time scaring the gun-toting vote out. You, on the other hand, are too smart for your own good, apparently.
April 12, 2008 8:52 PM | Reply | Permalink
You seem to possess some insight into the current location of Osama bin Laden. Where would that be, if not the Pakistan-Afghan border?
I am the most anti-Iraq war guy I know. I thought it was built on lies before it began, think it has always been indefensible. Voters who consider Bush and Kerry indistinguishable on the war, or Obama and McCain, should probably vote for Bugs Bunny, Ralph Nader, or someone else equivalent to not voting. The Nader voters put us in Iraq. I'm sorry that they don't understand that, but if one could go back in time, one hopes even they could bring themselves to acknowledge the gulf between Bush and Gore. (They won't, they're not the most self-critical lot.)
Refraining then from voting for Kerry in the next go-around is a form of projection, of blaming others for one's own failings. The Green Party of 2000 put us in Iraq. To have kowtowed further to it, the fatuous retrospective solution of the Greens to the problem they created, would have hurt Gore worse in the general, leading to the same result. If the moral imperative is against war, there are only two possible Presidents, and Greens ought to get with the one who opposed Iraq from the start. If politics is too dirty to participate in actual choosing, then that's fine. A vote for a third party is an abstention. Pretending it's not is wrong.
I agree with much of your critique of the pro-Israel lobby and its distortion of our foreign policy, but I'm not pro-Hamas. Folks who danced in the streets after 9/11, and who do not pose a threat to U.S. security, are neither morally worth meeting, nor (unlike Ahmedinejad, N Korea, Chavez) are they significant enough to us to meet with. A meeting with Hamas would be mere homage, since it poses no strategic threat to the U.S. and is not exporting terror to our shores.
April 12, 2008 7:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Your memory of Kerry's position on the war four years ago are faulty. His principal criticisms of Bush was that the war was being conducted poorly and was being lost. He called for increasing the number of troops so that the war could be won. His stated position in 2004 was to call for something close to what Bush has done subsequently under the rubric of "the surge." Kerry's clearly wasn't an anti-war candidacy. It was wishful thinking to view it as such at the time and it's a re-write of history to view it as such now.
Now, let's suppose that you are correct that votes for Nader and/or the Greens are responsible to Bush being elected and re-elected. Shouldn't the Democrats be doing what is necessary to get those votes this time? If you continue to blame those folks without considering why they should vote for the Democrat, you are likely to repeat the mistake. The people who voted for Nader did so because the found in not adequate merely to vote against Bush. They didn't find something to vote for in Kerry. My point is this: it's not enough to think people should vote against Bush, or this time to vote against McCain. We know they're terrible. The point is that we need positive reasons to vote for Obama other than that he states that he is for change and that the Republicans are terrible. To the extent that Obama repeats the mistake of Kerry in making serious anti-war voters to think he isn't really against the war, they won't vote for him. If Obama's loss is equivalent to the votes taken by Nader and McKinney, Obama should look in the mirror instead of griping about it and pointing fingers.
April 12, 2008 7:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
The notion that Obama isn't against the war is fatuous, and requires no thoughtful response. You base your views on your characterizations of his delegate choices as opposed to everything he's said since 2002. How many times must he say, the war should never have been authorized or waged, and we need to get the troops out and the money home to aid our people, to satisfy your perspective?
Kerry would have begun pulling out troops in 2005. http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=950DE7DB163FF931A2575BC0A9629C8B63. The suggestion that he was "prowar" in 2004 is ridiculous. He talked constantly of drawing down troops. His 02 vote was cowardly and wrong, but his 04 position was meaningfully closer to your and the abstainers' positions on the war than Bush's. Lives were lost over this margin of difference. That matters.
The Green Party took us to war by thoughtfully rejecting Gore for abstention, and if Obama loses to McCain by 5000 votes in a swing state, maybe it can take us to Iran, telling us all the while it's the Democratic Party's fault for not running as Neil Kinnick or Michael Dukakis or Jesse Jackson or other heroes of the low to mid-40s in voter appeal, as if the November vote is some science experiment to be sneered at rather than influence by, um, votes. There is not and never will be a Naderist Democrat majority, so if the far left must abstain to serve as a handmaiden of Bushism, so be it.
Je me souviens.
April 12, 2008 8:35 PM | Reply | Permalink
I have to say I'm extremely happy at the balance Obama has struck between progressive values while still remaining electable.
If "anti-war activists" are willing to throw their vote away to Nader and seal us with another 10,000 years in Iraq, that's their decision, and not Obama's. Hopefully they will listen to what he has to say, and realize he couldn't get elected if he was any more "radical".
April 12, 2008 7:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Is he being "less radical" in purging anti-war party activists from those who will attend the nations convention?
April 12, 2008 7:19 PM | Reply | Permalink
Would you have rather let Clinton's posturing about "I'll pull out no matter what" let delegates sway her way, only to have her invade Iran?
It's sad that he has to "play politics", but he has to.
And right now, I don't care WHAT he does. I've read her books, read his plans, searched his legislative record, and I JUST WANT HIM TO WIN!
He's the BEST choice from the choices left.
April 12, 2008 7:51 PM | Reply | Permalink
In no way am I arguing in favor of Hillary over Obama. I might end up voting for Obama, but could not vote for Hillary. She's shown her colors too truly for me to trust anything she says now about the war. But nothing says that I, or anyone of millions of others, will vote for Obama in November. Millions will stay home out of disgust and apathy stemming from the once-again lack of choice. Others will vote in protest for Nader of McKinney. You fail to face up to this at your own peril. So long as the Democrats think that they deserve our votes as the lesser of the evils, they will fail in what could be their historical mission to transform our political society for the good. They will encourage their natural base not to vote for them and the Republicans will continue winning much of the time as a minority party that knows how to activate its supporters.
April 12, 2008 7:59 PM | Reply | Permalink
By the way, if I vote for Obama and find that he keeps 60,000 to 80,000 troops in Iraq as his advisor is reported to have predicted, I will have thrown my vote away.
April 12, 2008 7:23 PM | Reply | Permalink
Really? Don't care about the Supreme Court, tax legislation, corporate governance and regulation, health care, education, the social safety-net and/or civil liberties? Are you, like so many prominent Naderites (Tim Robbins, Susan Sarandon, Michael Moore, Bill Maher) isolated by personal wealth from the real-life consequences of your vote? Must be nice. In a way.
That aside, I'd encourage you to think about one issue, the environment, that will affect you and yours no matter how big the trust fund. Just draw a mental picture of John Boehner and Mitch McConnell peeing in your drinking water. It's pretty close to accurate and will help remind you of the consequences of your vote if John McCain manages to shuffle into the White House.
The burned and bleeding children of Tehran thank you in advance.
April 12, 2008 7:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
You call me a Naderite. I'm not. I might end up voting for him, however, if I'm convinced that a vote for Obama is throwing my vote away. You're response, however, avoids the points I am trying to make. Let me try another way. Bush and Rove understood that they needed to cement their base and to motivate it to get to the polls and pull the Republican lever. The Democrats haven't learned a similar lesson. They drive away those who want real change, not just more of the same. Millions of people don't bother to vote. For them, appointments to the Supreme Court aren't sufficient motivation. A President who will continue that same old attitudes about war, who will continue the same old policies that favor Israel at the expense of freedom and justice in the middle East, who will continue to support outsourcing of jobs, driving down American moral prestige, etc., will leave millions not bothering to vote--even though you think the Supreme Court is important, they don't. And those who are serious about stopping the war will look elsewhere. You may think they are silly for not viewing the world as you do and holding their noses to vote to keep another Scalia or Thomas from the court. They think you are silly for continuing to accept the lesser of two evils. The Supreme Court is not a sufficient motivator, if that's basically all ya got. As for taxes and corporate regulation, the Democrats haven't distinguished themselves as anything but the other party that favors the rich and powerful. If better than the Republicans, only marginally so.
April 12, 2008 7:53 PM | Reply | Permalink
By the way, what have the Democrats in Congress done on civil rights in the Bush era except to vote to take them away. Nine hundred years of habeas corpus gone and the Democrats voted with the Republicans in sufficient numbers to accomplish this.
April 12, 2008 7:54 PM | Reply | Permalink
You claim to care about habeas. It's not just an abstraction of civil liberties, it's enforced day by day, by judges. Or not.
Democratic judges matter enormously. Clinton appointed a ton of liberals. I know many of them, and know their work and their commitment. If you've read about his stated plans, Obama would appoint a more definably liberal crowd. If you care about this, vote Obama. If you care about habeas corpus, vote for judges who support the writ.
The idea that Clinton judges are corporate hacks is an unbelievably sweeping disparagement of a host of caring, thoughtful liberals. To say that, one reveals that they know next to nothing of the work of Steve Breyer and Ruth Ginsburg, or of the Ninth Circuit under Chief Judge Schroeder. Demand more. You'll not get it on this planet, or in this lifetime. Or vote for Democrats to decide these questions. The Senate has before it a bill to expand by 68 the number of Article III judges. Obama would move us greatly to the left in this vital area. If you care, please weigh this in your thinking.
April 12, 2008 8:44 PM | Reply | Permalink
I find the blame placed on Nader for the loss in 2000 to be over blown. The purge of the voter rolls, the butterfly ballot, the lies in the MSM, Gore's refusal to have Clinton campaign for him, the supreme court and more all had a role to play. I see it as a firing squad with Nader and a dozen others in the ranks and Gore targeted with him holding a pistol to his own head. When the guns fired and Gore was dead everyone pointed to Nader as the killer.
As for Obama, I never thought he was progressive. His coalition of progressives, independents and moderate republicans is inherently unstable. These groups don't share the same policy positions and goals. When rhetoric changes to real policy positions the progressives will be shafted. Its the only way to maintain the coalition, be centrist and seek bipartisan solutions and talk the progressives to tag along with the compromise.
When ever I see people talk about Hagel, Bloomberg, or Powell as vp I cringe. And I cringe whenever I see obama say, like he recently did on Larry King, "By the way, I would reach out to the first George Bush. You know, one
of the things that I think George H.W. Bush doesn't get enough credit
for was his foreign policy team and the way that he helped negotiate
the end of the Cold War and prosecuted the Gulf War. That cost us 20
billion dollars. That's all it cost. It was extremely successful. I
think there were a lot of very wise people. So I want a bipartisan
team that can help to provide me good advice and counsel when I'm
President of the United States."
You all enjoy your bipartisan president, I want none of it. At a time when we could really move forward, with a democratic president and control of the congress, you all are going with the centrist.
April 12, 2008 7:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
And with a Congress--both branches--that "keep impeachment off the table," and continue to allow a Republican minority to set the agenda. All talk and no walk? This is a formula for massive voter abandonment of Obama (or most other Democratic candidates one could imagine). No only should the Democrats worry about people voting for Nader or McKinney rather than supporting the Democrats, there is the general apathy that comes from their "centrist" policies, from their general lack of guts, that keeps millions from bothering to vote at all, and few of these disillusioned voters are lost Republican votes. They could be going to the Democrats rather than staying at home. Combine them with the protest votes for Nader and McKinney, and the Democrats have only themselves to blame for the wasted opportunity for true improvements in our country and in the world.
April 12, 2008 7:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
But Hillary Lieberman Clinton, she of the AUMF, the Bankruptcy Bill, and Joe Lieberman's Travelling Videogame Roadshow, is a true progressive?
April 12, 2008 8:01 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hillary is not a valid option. She's voted consistently as a Senator in favor of war. She voted to start the war. She voted to continue the war. She voted to allow war to start against Iran (the Lieberman bill naming parts of Iran's army a terrorist organization). She has voted consistently to support corporate interests against the interests of the people. Anyone taken in by recent populist words is a fool. That leaves the question of Obama and whether his behaviors and positions are inviting people not to bother voting for him in November. You are used to Hillary vs. Barack debates on the pages of TPM. This is not such a debate. My fear is that an Obama candidacy is unfolding in such a way as to invite me and others not to bother voting for him. Granted, this may have the unfortunate effect of electing McCain. But another round of arguments that we must support the Democrat because he isn't the Republican will lead either to defeat or to a hollow victory like the Bill Clinton victory: Republican light. Millions will stay home rather to bother getting to the polls. Millions more are likely to vote for Nader or McKinney in disgust with what the Democrats have offered once again. The Democrats: We have ourselves to blame for the success of the Republicans because we collectively have offered such a weak alternative.
April 12, 2008 8:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
You might have seen this:
http://www.jedreport.com/2008/04/hillary-clint-4.html
The snippet of the Nov 23, 2004 interview with Charlie Rose that's at the end of this clip is KEY for me.
The whole interview is pretty good, I don't have a link handy, but I'm sure you could find it...
April 12, 2008 8:21 PM | Reply | Permalink
I'm not sure what you want me to take from this clip. If you think I am making serious critical comments about Obama because I support Hillary, then you haven't bothered reading what I've written on this page. Hillary is out of the question. I'm trying to state what Obama and the Democrats need to do to make Obama a good choice and not merely the lesser-of-the-evils choice. We know he's less disgusting than either Hillary or McCain. We need to demand much more than this.
April 12, 2008 8:27 PM | Reply | Permalink
Point is, Obama shares your view that the Dems are big wooses these days. But the way to change that is not to run against them. You have to take over from within.
A third party, unfortunately, gets no seat at the table.
April 12, 2008 9:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
No Hillary is not a true progressive but I do believe she's more progressive than Obama. The leftovers just aren't left enough for me. (cudoes to workerbee for the great line.) You're not going to hear anyone talking about Hagel, Bloomberg, or Powell as her vp. Nor can you expect a bunch of republicans in a Hillary administration. She would be about winning and only be as bipartisan as is necessary to pass legislation. The problem in Washington is not the bitter partisanship. I totally disagree with Obama. Its that there's not enough partisanship. This is what I'd like to see more of from democrats.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZVyqGv9FqD4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4iHan7BjqY
You can be sure that Hillary would be putting the republicans in their place.
April 12, 2008 8:24 PM | Reply | Permalink
Hillary is just as much a person of the corporate interests as is McCain. Her husband's administration was as far to the right as was Eisenhower's. The world economy is about to implode as a result of Clinton policies together with Bush policies. They both de-regulated and gave gifts after gift to the big-monied interests. Bill nominated Republicans to his Cabinet. He nominated pro-business judges to the Supreme Court. He remember non-Republican Presidents, and Bill Clinton was not one of them.
April 12, 2008 8:32 PM | Reply | Permalink
Nor can you expect a bunch of republicans in a Hillary administration.
Just good progressives like Mark Penn and Dick Morris, eh? Ed Koch? Bob Kerrey? Bob "death tax" Johnson?
I haven't heard anyone from Obama's campaign talk about any of the people you mention as Veep. I've heard people suggest Chuck Hagel as SecDef, and I'd rather have that than Evan Bayh as VP, Bob Kerrey in charge of anything, or Mark Pryor making any decisions whatsoever, regardless of the letter they put after their name.
April 12, 2008 8:29 PM | Reply | Permalink