Cooked Intel: So the 'Stovepipe' Stops Where?
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue?
Today, on the normal Friday news-dump, the latest findings come out of the inspector general's office of the Pentagon claiming "...that prewar intelligence work at the Pentagon, including a contention that the CIA had underplayed the likelihood of an al-Qaida connection, was inappropriate but not illegal."
Cooking the books in August 2002, under the watchful eyes of "...Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz who reviewed CIA intelligence analyses for further use..." by the ever loquacious Don Rumsfeld to shove up the stovepipe, at the Office of Special plans, the IG report found that ....
"former Pentagon policy chief Douglas J. Feith had not engaged in illegal activities through the creation of special offices to review intelligence." Although, Senator Carl Levin "...said the IG report is 'very damning' and shows a Pentagon policy shop trying to shape intelligence to prove a link between al-Qaida and Saddam."
'Very Damning' Report: Pentagon Manipulated Pre-war Intel
Feith has been quoted as saying "Clearly, the inspector general's office was willing to challenge the policy office and even stretch some points to be able to criticize it." And for someone who should really know what he's talking about when it comes to the act of quibbling, Feith also added that he felt this amounted to subjective "quibbling" by the IG.
Now with the smoke and smudge supposedly cleared from the section of stovepipe at the Pentagon and with this latest information out of the way, we can now continue up the stovepipe to the vicinity of, 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue!
Specifically, to the table of the White House Iraq Group (WHIG) and the offices of the vice-president...
And of course, the only way to do that is for the Senate Intelligence Committee to take immediate action to complete and finish that portion of it's work, that was promised to be completed by ex-chairman Pat Roberts in its investigation into the prewar intelligence on Iraq.
It has been two and one-half years (2-1/2) since it released the first part of its findings in July 2004.
Does it really make a difference if we find out what the facts of this matter are? Or do we all simply just sit around and wait for history to write the final chapter?
~OGD~
ps: Maybe by the time they get all of this completed my 6 year old grandson will have graduated college. That way he may have some type of worthwhile employment, so as to help pay the freight on all of this....
ALSO NOTE: This subject has been placed in the Moderation queue for member's consideration to be added to the Top Discussion Table.


Before I leave for the afternoon...
I wish to point out that there are more pressing personal tragedies beside this stinking mess with Iraq ...
My heartfelt condolences, and I do mean heartfelt -- go out to the family and friends of Anna Nicole Smith. May time heal their wounds.
Having lost our daughter many moons ago brings memories like a flood of grief welling within my chest. I'm off to take a wee bit of time to be with and console our Anna's mother .... And also gain strength from her at this time...
~OGD~
February 9, 2007 4:34 PM | Reply | Permalink
Sorry to hear about your daughter, OGD.
Tom
February 10, 2007 7:16 AM | Reply | Permalink
My sympathies about bad memories renewed.
I usually think of an intelligence stovepipe as an isolated collection and processing system, such as a photoimaging satellite and photogrammetry system that isn't correlated, say, with electronic captures and human reports from the same area. This would appear to be a failure at the policy level. Feith's office was not in the intelligence community proper, so this would appear to be a failure of the use of intelligence in DoD. Am I missing something?
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 9, 2007 4:48 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the thought Howard ...
I was originally going to title this: Cooked Intel: So the 'Sewer' Stops Where?
But that wouldn't play well as a catchy title, and anyhoo, shit doesn't run uphill, even though there has been no lack of the pugent effluent leaking outta this White 'Out' House... I'd say your use of the word 'failure' is not only an understatement, but doesn't even come close to capture the true essence of the deviousness of this matter.
~OGD~
ps: I did check around on line and found some things related to you... Thanks for being accomadating.
February 9, 2007 11:13 PM | Reply | Permalink
~
This has been posted--so as not to get lost in the fog of time . . .
The entire interview continues at: http://www.laweekly.com/news/news/soldier-for-the-truth/1977/
~OGD~
June 26, 2007 1:50 AM | Reply | Permalink
Come on Howard.
Now let's jump down to the W.M.D.s. and the Iraqi nuclear program where it's being presented that....With all kidding aside from my previous post on Saturday: Let me say that I respect whatever personal/professional description you wish to put on this. But you're well enough aware to know exactly why I have used "Stovepipe" in this context of my topic.
Let's take a look at the following:
And then we go to the Chalabi angle ....
That's all from: THE STOVEPIPE
Therefore, with all due respect, my: Cooked Intel: So the 'Stovepipe' Stops Where?
~OGD~
ps: Howard: You aren't missing anything. Yes. It does appear to be a 'failure' at the policy level. But, it's more that just a simple 'failure' which implies a possibility of a mistake. It was a concerted effort to manufacture, "Cooked Intel" . . .
February 13, 2007 5:02 AM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the link; it was Hersch's usage. Yes, I may be being pedantic, but just within the intelligence community, there are lots of efforts to avoid what they consider stovepiping -- which is different from this.
Modern history tends to show that it's a bad idea to give raw intelligence, without interpretation, to policymakers, except in the unusual case where the policymaker understands the methodology. Art Lundahl, the father of US photoreconaissance, was a master of such interpretation. During the Cuban Missile Crisis, he paused as he pulled another photograph from the locked portfolio, and said, "Mr. President, you've asked me to explain the difference between a site in preparation and a site in use."
He then pulled out an overhead photo (from one of the missile sites) of a three-hole latrine, with one man sitting down.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 13, 2007 9:45 AM | Reply | Permalink
Bolton was the guy with whom I had to do business, Thielmann said. We were going to provide him with all the information he was entitled to see. Thats what being a professional intelligence officer is all about. THE STOVEPIPE [emphasis added]
It seems to me that this statement reflects an arrogant, bureaucratic attitude that no self-respecting senior executive should be expected to up with put.
It is one thing to accompany a report of intelligence findings with as many provisos and warnings as the "professional intelligence officer" believes to be warranted. It is quite another thing to say that the subordinate officer has the right to censor what his superior reads -- and even more so when the junior officer claims he needn't tell the superior what it is the superior isn't being allowed to know.
February 13, 2007 12:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
I have to disagree, for more than one reason. First, the source may be exceptionally critical and already under need-to-know controls by the originator. Originator control is authorized by a DCI Directive that the President certainly can reveal.
There is also a difference between sensitivity of the material and sensitivity of the source. Bolton was probably entitled to see the material, but not the identity of a human source, or the nature of a communications intelligence method, that easily could be rendered useless.
It also can be reasonable, depending on the nature of the material, not to provide highly technical details that are apt to be misinterpreted.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 13, 2007 1:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
I read Thielman's dismissive statement more broadly than you do.
It is one thing to keep the identity of a source secret from one's superior; it is another thing to keep the fact of the source secret. The "professional intelligence officer" must be required to identify what he or she is relying upon and to set forth each and every fact which has led him or her to give or deny credence to the source's report. (If observance of that rule leads to source identification, so be it)
Secrecy, the last refuge of the bureaucratic player, is the issue.
February 13, 2007 2:10 PM | Reply | Permalink
Ellen says: Ellen says:
And the authority on which you base this, is?Do you work in this environment?
~OGD~
February 13, 2007 2:28 PM | Reply | Permalink
Even at the level of intelligence analysts cleared for all levels, sources are concealed, to varying extents. At the compartmented security level, a human source still might be identified only with a code word and "a member of the Chinese military with access to planning documents of the high command". At a lower level, the individual code word might be part of a family name, and the description might be "A Chinese source with access to military thinking." Somewhat lower might be "A proven source with access to the Chinese military establishment."
The analyst in the Directorate of Intelligence may not see the Clandestine Services operational codeword (formally cryptonym) of CNROBERT-3. The analyst certainly would not know it was Wong Chen Li.
Having this level of detail, without a substantial amount of contextual information, really doesn't add information. In the case of technical information, I might understand the principle by which a MASINT sensor obtained the sidelobe pattern from an antenna, but I'd still have to go through the data base of antenna patterns.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 13, 2007 2:55 PM | Reply | Permalink
It seems to me that before a criticism of Feith and Luti's operation can get started we must answer at least these two questions:
1. What is the proper portfolio of an intelligence operation in and for the DoD? Support of troops (tactical and strategic)? Support of policy? Geopolitical? And who (Congress? POTUS? SecDef?) determines the limitations, if any?
2. Who are the proper customers for DoD intelligence providers? In addition to DoD personnel for whom the intelligence product was produced, to whom outside DoD (other governmental agencies and actors, the public, etc.) may DoD intelligence personnel communicate that intelligence?
As Feith says regularly, his activities were authorized by his superior, Paul Wolfowitz. If true, did Wolfowitz have the legal authority to so authorize? If so, should Jay Rockefeller be looking to clip the wings of these proto-007s?
February 10, 2007 12:10 AM | Reply | Permalink
Let me answer first with what doctrine, much of it preceding the current Administration says, and then address some of the issues. I will also try to offer comments on your second question.
First, do note that there are service-level and national-level DoD intelligence operations, and, of the latter, there are some that are rather more (DIA) and less (NSA/CSS) directly involved with direct military operations.
Support of troops starts with intelligence functions built into them. An Army or Marine battalion has an intelligence officer and a very small number of assistants, and may control battlefield collection assets such as human scouts, Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAV), short-range radars, etc.
In the reorganization of the Army around the new brigade structure, there is a quite substantial component in each brigade charged with intelligence and closely related functions. The jawbreaker of the designation is C4ISRSTA:
Intelligence components go up the troop command chain. As one gets higher, there are interesting methods where troops can access resources, such as satellite photography. This is under a program called TENCAP (Tactical Exploitation of National Intelligence Capabilities). There are also programs that allow troops to get information relevant to national intelligence into national channels quite quickly; it doesn't flow all the way up the military food change. The different services have different names for the latter function.
There are times that military detachments with a primarily national mission (e.g., communications intelligence) are attached for tactical unit, mostly so they can be protected as they approach something accessible only from short range.
So, one answer, a partial one, is that there is a clear troop support function, and a feeder from field units into the national intelligence process.
At the Service and DoD national level, you have several DoD and joint-to-various-levels members of the intelligence community. The Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) runs collectors including military attaches and spies recruited through military channels. DIA is the national center for a very specialized and technical topic, Measurement and Signal Intelligence (MASINT). I'm happy to discuss what goes into MASINT, but it would be a digression here.
DIA and Service agencies do references and elements on foreign militaries, doctrine, and equipment. Some of this is in DIA, which may assemble multiple military contribution. The Army, for example, has the National Ground Intelligence Center (Charlottesville, VA) containing the highly regarded Intelligence Threat Analysis Detachment. The Air Force has several comparable units, such as the Foreign Technology Division in Dayton, OH.
DIA and usually the service agencies are involved in either writing or reviewing national documents, such as National Intelligence Estimates (NIE). These are contributions of the entire intelligence community, and certainly feed into policy but are not supposed to have policy recommendations.
Estimates, or other documents called net assessments in the US -- the better Soviet-coined term is correlation of forces -- which examine the military context of various policy choices, especially dealing with the balance of US vs. foreign troops available. GEN Shinseki's comments on the size of force needed for an Iraqi occupation is a classic correlation of forces analysis, but remember that he was acting at a national policy, not intelligence, level when he made that assessment to COngress.
The limitations of portfolio are specific to programs, and truly the White House, Congress, and Pentagon all are involved.
Depending on the product, military organizations, other intelligence agencies, Congress, the White House, other cabinet agencies, and indeed the public. I'd have to deal with specific examples, but a good deal of military references are available, admittedly not always easy to find. I'd add that while they are not strictly intelligence community, a lot of very good, very accessible information comes out of both the student papers at the midcareer and senior military colleges, and the separate research institutes attached to them.
As to Feith, I remain confused why we are calling his activities intelligence. It appears that he took intelligence information and selectively inserted it into the policy process, not the intelligence process.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 10, 2007 10:54 AM | Reply | Permalink
If I'm confused (my fault not yours), your final rhetorical(?) question may make my confusion nugatory.
I had thought that Feith and Luti were running an intelligence shop parallel to the CIA on behalf of and whose sole customers were the WHIG and the OVP -- the product intended to be latterly disseminated to the media for public consumption (Laurie Mylroie being considered insufficiently persuasive).
And if Feith's operation could have had little or no conceivable benefit to DoD's mission, were Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz, in effect, authorizing illegal payments (staffs and assets were paid, after all) -- it not being overly legalistic to think of those internal payments as another Iran-Contra Swiss bank account off-the-books type gambit?
February 10, 2007 12:12 PM | Reply | Permalink
As I understand it, their shop was closer to being a parallel NSC: a place where policy recommendations were made on the basis of the interpretation of intelligence. I don't think they were seriously saying they were processing, analyzing, or estimating; they were making policy recommendations. While the concept is often honored more than in the breach than the observance, a classic principle of intelligence is that the information gatherers and analysts are not policymakers.
If you are referring to payments to external assets, that falls into another classic problem: the conflation of true intelligence activities(i.e., information gathering) with covert and clandestine operations. The OSS and CIA always have mixed these activities and operations, which do have a coordination requirement and often need some of the same support.
Mixing or separating is a damned-if-you-do, damned-if-you-don't problem. In WWII, the British tried splitting MI6 secret intelligence collection from SOE covert warfare (but with some intelligence networks), and did trip over each other, with the compromise of networks at times. For lack of an all-cleared coordination body, OSS operations people in Lisbon bungled a burglary of the Japanese Embassy, causing the Japanese to change cryptosystems that might have been compromised -- including one we were reading.
Bungled burglary. It has a certain ring to it. Watergate also was an example of unwise clandestine operations.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 10, 2007 4:16 PM | Reply | Permalink
I don't have a good metaphor to describe my inquietude as I try to get a handle on what the neocons, what Wilkerson called a "cabal," what the WHIG MadAv wannabes (Rice, Hadley, Matalin, Libby) what Cheney and Addington in the OVP and what others did. It feels like I'm looking at an energy field in physics where particles keep popping up and are then annihilated before they can be identified. Maybe it's just bats in my belfry.
For those of us who would like to put those folks in jail (impeachment is a non-starter), we must begin by admitting that manipulation of intelligence, at least at the level of assessment, is never or hardly ever provable. Everyone has a right to his or her opinion as daft as it may be.
But is there something they did which was criminal? When they cashed their payroll checks were they stealing government monies, because they weren't performing services for the government?
I sense that there's something here but can't get my arms around it.
February 10, 2007 8:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
I would like Bush and Cheney both impeached and convicted, and the entire WHIG sent to the International court of Justice at the Hague to be tried as war criminals.
Tom
February 10, 2007 9:47 PM | Reply | Permalink
I have tried to think how these Neocons should be charged.
It has been difficult as some charges are too limiting
and some do not cover the territory of crimes.
The only word and its synonyms that seem to cover
the offences would be the act of whoredom.
It seems to take in the territory!
-----------------------------------------------
Today, are we searching for I deals or Ideals?
-Thinking
February 11, 2007 12:33 AM | Reply | Permalink
It is satisfying, I know, to think about punishing such people. It is more satisfying to have a plan and most satisfying to succeed in carrying it out. Libby has provided a mechanism for his case.
Realistically, GWB is best targeted, first with hearings not dealing with impeachment but with Constitutional abuses. The same applies to Cheney, although there seems some sentiment that resignation, under pressure, might be conceivable -- I'm not sure his ego would accept that.
When you get to Cabinet officers and below, I have more trouble thinking about a mechanism. Realistically, no US official at that level, even after leaving office, is going to put himself into a position where a third nation can try to extradite him to the ICC. I really don't like the idea that any nation can act unilaterally to take someone into custody for the ICC, conceivably taking someone by force.
Were military officers involved, there are court-martial offenses associated with doing one's duty. We are kindler and gentler than things our British cousins did in the past; find a good medium and consult with the shade of Admiral John Byng.
But, there aren't such rules for appointed officials. Spending funds in ways they were not appropriated may be one technical area, although that will run into lots of precedent, unitary authority, etc. Again, there are legitimate cases where officials shift funds to meet contigencies.
If they lied to Congress, that's a potential area, but they may not have spoken to Congress on the relevant issue.
Other than wanting to see people punished, what does US Code offer as an approach?
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 11, 2007 10:12 AM | Reply | Permalink
Hold them accountable for defrauding the American people and Congress. See Elizabet de la Vega's book, "United States v. George W. Bush, et al."
Tom
February 11, 2007 2:36 PM | Reply | Permalink
Could you summarize her theory of how the felony of fraud applies, preferably with case law if any?
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 11, 2007 3:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Howard,
It's a 256 page book, but on p. 27 it says "...proposed indictment: Conspiracy to Defraud the United States in violation of Title 18, United States Code, Section 371".
Tom
February 11, 2007 5:08 PM | Reply | Permalink
Tuetext and some commentary on the statute, which appears to deal principally with conspiracy against the government. Now, from my general understanding of the definition of the felony of fraud, it involves deceit to obtain goods and services for the fraudster. I have not heard of allegations that these individuals obtained goods and services. If their actions led fraudulently to payments to a third party, such as Chalabi, it's beyond my legal knowledge, but I don't think the proposed indictment on that statute is exactly a slam-dunk.
There's no question that misfeasance and malfeasance of office apply, but those are not criminal. You'll remember Ollie North was indicted for a long list of crimes and convicted for three, although these eventually were dismissed because he had been immunized for his Congressional testimony. One charge was receiving an illegal gratuity, of a security system for his house.
The other two might be more applicable, aiding and abetting in the obstruction of a congressional inquiry, and destroying documents. Now, this could easily turn into an executive privilege issue, but it might be appropriate for people to review, in great detail, their testimony to Congress and if they could not produce certain documents to which Congress reasonably would have access, even if classified. In general, an appropriate Committee or Committee Member, cleared for national security information, should be able to get things that were not used in direct advice to the President.
There's the old saying "when you shoot at a king, you must kill him." I hear much frustrated about illegality, but, given to whom the Justice Department reports, the legal basis must be absolutely clear-cut, not just creative interpretation.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 11, 2007 6:42 PM | Reply | Permalink
The Enron case is the case de la Vega constantly refers to.
Tom
February 11, 2007 9:26 PM | Reply | Permalink
Enron fairly clearly hid income, which could be defrauding the government. They also violated securities and financial reporting laws from hell to breakfast.
Analogies to very different cases, such as corporations rather than government officials, are suspect. Let de la Vega produce a representative indictment for discussion.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 11, 2007 9:46 PM | Reply | Permalink
I would recommend you check out her book. She has much more detail than I have time to relay.
Tom
February 12, 2007 5:23 AM | Reply | Permalink
.
Elizabeth de la Vega speaking of the Enron case:
Speaking of the actions of Bush and his aides:
Again:And at this link you will find the Indictment that Ms. de la Vega prepared. If you don't have the time to digest it, book-mark that page for later reading.
~OGD~
February 12, 2007 1:11 PM | Reply | Permalink
Thanks for the references; I appreciate them.
Do understand that I believe GWB's inner circle seethes with an absence, nay, a destruction of ethics. Whether or not they will meet the test of criminality, sufficiently that the Justice Department will indict, is a separate issue.
Most trial attorneys practice, when possible, with the best possible colleague arguing the other side's case. If the forces opposed to Bush policies, and I consider myself one of them, cannot agree that they have an ironclad case, they aren't ready to go the criminal court route. It is my impression that fraud does involve something of financial value usually going to the fraudster, or possibly someone for whom he is an agent, and with whom he has probably conspired.
In many respects, the Congressional inquiry route -- and not impeachment hearings yet -- is a better one. The standard for compelling testimony is softer than in criminal court, yet someone may slip and make themselve guilty of the separate crime of misleading Congress. A committee may also decide to immunize one individual and obtain their testimony regarding worse actors.
--
Howard
*equal opportunity offense to both extremes*
February 12, 2007 1:17 PM | Reply | Permalink
Howard ... a few days back we spoke about a person that you seemed to have respect for, and from what you said, you have read quite a bit of this individual's writings ... correct me if I'm wrong.
Here's a little trip in the wayback machine to a published article from 2004:
There one may find one of the best complete rundowns from the spring of 2000, including info on policy-making, all the way through to March 19, 2003 when the bombs began to fall...
An invaluable reference for anyone who's memory has greyed from the "fog of war" . . .
~OGD~
February 15, 2007 5:15 PM | Reply | Permalink